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CRITiQUE IN THESE FORUMS

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Old 12-11-2006, 07:27 PM   #1 (permalink)
Name: Nikos Tselepides
Last Online:
04-27-2008 01:13 PM
Default CRITiQUE IN THESE FORUMS Nikos Tselepides Started This Thread


I have been taken to task twice by Sage for writing critical comments to two of her poems, though they contained nothing offensive.

Sage said :

"I didn't ask you to critique my poems and stop doing it." Or words to that effect any way. Note well that she did not say the same thing to the other posters who thought her poem was great and all was marvellous and perfect. To them it was sonnets of love and thank-yous and nice smilies, to me it was all the worst smilie icons she could find in the lower part of the posting screen.

Then, to my utter and complete surprise, I discovered there is a special section here for poems to be "critiqued". That must an International First Innovation I thought, and I am sure it is.

That is the first time I see this special kind of section and any poetry forums, and I have been to many and write in many and even moderate one.

I have posted some critical comments to other poets, but no one but Sage took offense. She gives me the impression that unless the critique is favorable, I have to ask permission from her ladyship to add critical comments.

I find that totally unacceptable and undemocratic.
This is the rant forum, so I am ranting, that is complaining (that is how I understand the word "rant" at least).

I further wonder how can a forum expect its writers to improve when criticism, usually well-meant and constructive, is not allowed.

I have no need of recognition--neither from this forum or any other in the web. I have my publishers in 4 countires and my own public already, and have had them for 35 years or more. I only write to communicate what I feel. My poetry is me.
And I came into this forum by accident, as a result of an email I got in its campaign to get new members. I love the friendly interface of this forum and its warm colors--I happen to be a painter too, so I am sensitive to visuals. And I have already established a good rapport with one member here and have contributed some of my work.
But I know one thing: this forum will not retain any professional members for long if they cannot express their views. Who on earth wants pampering and constant bravos and pats on the head with comments like "wonderful poem" and the like all the time?? That would bore me to tears.
I love criticism, and, regarding my own work, you can hit me with an axe till I bleed and I will not complain but will discuss the issues and learn from the comments of others. All criticism, favorable or non-, is constuctive to me, without exception. One learns from wrong criticism too at times, and I have seen comments by 14-year-olds that stunned me with their insights.

I dislike hypocrisy. If I see what I think is a flaw I will point it out without being offensive to the writer. Most writers understand and react properly and in a civilized manner. That is called good manners and proper breeding, or "etiquette" to use the very old but fashionable French word.
I would like some feedback on this. What do you think? What do the moderators think about this issue? Can one post critical comments only in that one section mentioned above or elsewhere too? Can I be so wrong after all and do we live in an age where no one can speak freely?




Last edited by MsJacquiiC; 12-11-2006 at 08:13 PM. Reason: moved to Comments, Concerns, Questions section, as it is afterall a "rant" about JPiC :)
 

Old 12-11-2006, 08:16 PM   #2 (permalink)
Miss Understood
MsJacquiiC's Avatar
Name: Jacquii Cooke
Gender: Female
Location: In a cloud of smoke.
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Last Online:
Yesterday 06:05 PM
Default EXCERPT from rude Private Message from Nikos Tselepides...
Just a piece of a rude PM from NIKOS to MsJacquiiC...

The Following Text Is Quoted:
Originally Posted by Nikos Tselepides
Though I like your forum--it seems to have a wonderful and user-friendly interface and some good writers as far as I can tell--I am not one to be pushed around in this way.

To which I responded in kind...
The Following Text Is Quoted:
Originally Posted by MsJacquiiC
Not to be a complete and total B-I-T-C-H - but I will be happy to remove you from the JPiC Member list.

Please email Webmistress@JPiCForum.info if this is what you so desire.

I and my Moderating team do move posts from time to time - no matter how established or how many publication credits the member has....

Jacquii.



“I do use powerful words to evoke emotion, but also to stimulate imagination. If one can 'see' the words dance before
his eyes - then he can likely feel, smell and even taste them as well. And I do thoroughly enjoy really tasty poems.
My poetry is an emotions-fest sprinkled with a little garlic salt, Mrs. Dash, fresh ginger and Tabasco sauce...
My poetry is like a piece of General Tso's chicken tossed in ghetto soul.” ---
MsJacquiiC



JacquiiCooke.com | Poetica Magnifique
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:17 PM   #3 (permalink)
Miss Understood
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Name: Jacquii Cooke
Gender: Female
Location: In a cloud of smoke.
MsJacquiiC's Mood:
Last Online:
Yesterday 06:05 PM
Default Re: CRITiQUE IN THESE FORUMS
An AWKWARD post in a welcome thread from NIKOS in which MsJacquiiC moved, as the topic was seperate from the original welcome thread AND totally UGH!

http://jpicforum.info/showthread.php?p=7546#post7546



“I do use powerful words to evoke emotion, but also to stimulate imagination. If one can 'see' the words dance before
his eyes - then he can likely feel, smell and even taste them as well. And I do thoroughly enjoy really tasty poems.
My poetry is an emotions-fest sprinkled with a little garlic salt, Mrs. Dash, fresh ginger and Tabasco sauce...
My poetry is like a piece of General Tso's chicken tossed in ghetto soul.” ---
MsJacquiiC



JacquiiCooke.com | Poetica Magnifique
Professional Web & Graphic Design Services
GreetingsGalleryOnline | Beautifully Free e-Cards


You REALLY Like Us? ==> Support JPiC with a donation or Purchase a premium membership

 

Old 12-11-2006, 08:31 PM   #4 (permalink)
~Pixie Princess~
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~Serenity~'s Mood:
Last Online:
12-16-2011 05:06 PM
Default Re: CRITiQUE IN THESE FORUMS
HURRAH NIKOS! (Very nice name by the way =D ) - hehe yes of course, this is the place to rant and get the angries off your chest. Remember - if it gets REALLY bad, send a PM to me, another mod, or MsJacquiiC herself. Or try in the "Questions, Comments, Concerns" forum to get other member feedback first.

YES! This has been an issue on JPiC before, as it has most assuredly been on every other public writing forum on the net. As a poet, I can't stand seeing writers react negatively to honest, well-meaning reviews! Especially on a forum designed specifically for that purpose!! If you only want to fish for compliments, go talk to your friends. That's what they're there for. I've never seen this issue with Sage in particular... But (not mentioning names) I have had to keep an eye on a few members who get especially out of hand in this area. When reviewing, I try to remember who is "sensitive" (for lack of a better word) in this way - and avoid the hell outta their stuff! Unless it's in the critique forum of course. It saves a LOT of stress on my part, and preserves their precious egos.... (I feel like going and mumbling angry words under my breath here... But I know I'm guilty of being "sensitive" on occasion so I won't!) I never post in the critique forum myself - I figure that since I don't want to be published, why should I worry about making such high-level poetry? Leave that to the pro's!

Officially, the guideline is somewhat like this:
Critique forum: heavy, in-depth, nit-picky type critiques to get those poems to publisher's level! Yay teamwork
Every other forum: not so serious reviews... but still helpful. point out typos and grammatical junk, or suggest an edit of rhythm/rhyme etc...
...Well, it's supposed to be like this. But not everybody gets it, as you said...

As a MOD, this issue downright pisses me off. Because then not only do I see the fighting, but then I know I'm allowed to step in and stop them using FORCE. Plus, I know it's my duty to report to MsJ if the involved members don't stop - and I hate to see anybody gettin' into pointless trouble. This is actually the reason JPiC has had a banned member. AH! Sadness of sadnesses. I sometimes wanna tell those "sensitive" poets to grow up or get out!! Or maybe... Just warn the public. "Warning: Sensitive artist. Compliments only please, to feed my ego, even if my poem is shit, or I will hate you and call you n00b." URGH!

Nikos! You've got the JPiC spirit - don't soften your words just to pad egos! That's just cruelty to poetry. Fight the good fight! - at least 90% of JPiC is with ya on this!

Smiles!,
~Serenity~
 

Old 12-11-2006, 08:35 PM   #5 (permalink)
Miss Understood
MsJacquiiC's Avatar
Name: Jacquii Cooke
Gender: Female
Location: In a cloud of smoke.
MsJacquiiC's Mood:
Last Online:
Yesterday 06:05 PM
Default Re: CRITiQUE IN THESE FORUMS
The Following Text Is Quoted:
Originally Posted by Nikos Tselepides


I have been taken to task twice by Sage for writing critical comments to two of her poems, though they contained nothing offensive.

Sage said :

"I didn't ask you to critique my poems and stop doing it." Or words to that effect any way. Note well that she did not say the same thing to the other posters who thought her poem was great and all was marvellous and perfect. To them it was sonnets of love and thank-yous and nice smilies, to me it was all the worst smilie icons she could find in the lower part of the posting screen.

Then, to my utter and complete surprise, I discovered there is a special section here for poems to be "critiqued". That must an International First Innovation I thought, and I am sure it is.

That is the first time I see this special kind of section and any poetry forums, and I have been to many and write in many and even moderate one.

I have posted some critical comments to other poets, but no one but Sage took offense. She gives me the impression that unless the critique is favorable, I have to ask permission from her ladyship to add critical comments.

I find that totally unacceptable and undemocratic.
This is the rant forum, so I am ranting, that is complaining (that is how I understand the word "rant" at least).

I further wonder how can a forum expect its writers to improve when criticism, usually well-meant and constructive, is not allowed.

I have no need of recognition--neither from this forum or any other in the web. I have my publishers in 4 countires and my own public already, and have had them for 35 years or more. I only write to communicate what I feel. My poetry is me.
And I came into this forum by accident, as a result of an email I got in its campaign to get new members. I love the friendly interface of this forum and its warm colors--I happen to be a painter too, so I am sensitive to visuals. And I have already established a good rapport with one member here and have contributed some of my work.
But I know one thing: this forum will not retain any professional members for long if they cannot express their views. Who on earth wants pampering and constant bravos and pats on the head with comments like "wonderful poem" and the like all the time?? That would bore me to tears.
I love criticism, and, regarding my own work, you can hit me with an axe till I bleed and I will not complain but will discuss the issues and learn from the comments of others. All criticism, favorable or non-, is constuctive to me, without exception. One learns from wrong criticism too at times, and I have seen comments by 14-year-olds that stunned me with their insights.

I dislike hypocrisy. If I see what I think is a flaw I will point it out without being offensive to the writer. Most writers understand and react properly and in a civilized manner. That is called good manners and proper breeding, or "etiquette" to use the very old but fashionable French word.
I would like some feedback on this. What do you think? What do the moderators think about this issue? Can one post critical comments only in that one section mentioned above or elsewhere too? Can I be so wrong after all and do we live in an age where no one can speak freely?




1st thing I would suggest to you MR NIKOS is to read each and every one of the JPiC policies before ever posting again ---------> http://jpicforum.info/showthread.php?p=6575#post6575

2nd thing I would say is

3rd thing is that JPiC is for amateur writers, hobbyist writers, as well as professional writers with all types of publication credits dripping from their anus, as well as their poetic lips...

4th thing I say is - Not everyone on JPiC would like to create a Nikos Tselepides ORIGINAL... Meaning - that you may not like the poem OR think that it could be better presented if YOU wrote it....

Brings me to the 5th thing: There is the The Critique Saloon for "in-depth" critiques. Your comments about that: AWESOMELY rude and ill-informed... Of course this is likely the 1st forum you've seen with such a section. At JPiC we care about our Members' work enough to wanna give advice on "how to improve your writing for publication endeavors." It might do you well to read the Guidelines of that section: http://jpicforum.info/showthread.php?t=321

6th thing: HOW DARE YOU! As a Member of this site (New Member actually) say But I know one thing: this forum will not retain any professional members for long if they cannot express their views. I tend to wonder if all "Professional" writers are so horridly stuck on their own "Genius" as you seem to be... In which case - there is like a better fitted forum for their obnoxiously HUGE heads...

7th thing I think of is

8th thing? Get over yourself

9th thing is Thanx for your obvious concern, ridiculous posturing, rude postering and fabulous Community attitude

10 thing is that this thread is now closed - How's that for democracy?



Jacquii.

oops - 11th thing - If you continue your Membership... Happy posting!



“I do use powerful words to evoke emotion, but also to stimulate imagination. If one can 'see' the words dance before
his eyes - then he can likely feel, smell and even taste them as well. And I do thoroughly enjoy really tasty poems.
My poetry is an emotions-fest sprinkled with a little garlic salt, Mrs. Dash, fresh ginger and Tabasco sauce...
My poetry is like a piece of General Tso's chicken tossed in ghetto soul.” ---
MsJacquiiC



JacquiiCooke.com | Poetica Magnifique
Professional Web & Graphic Design Services
GreetingsGalleryOnline | Beautifully Free e-Cards


You REALLY Like Us? ==> Support JPiC with a donation or Purchase a premium membership

 


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